I never actually worked on Sundays, but my experience with Christians at any other time (even slow, non-rush periods) left me with the same impression - rude and low tippers. It was really embarassing to me when I would say "hi" to someone from my own church and then their waitor would complain about the bad tip and rude behavior.

I would say that my opinion of this only came from those that you could identify as Christians - they either left a tract, or talked a lot about their church (enough for me the hear it when I came up to the table). Other than that, there really is no way to tell if someone was a Christian. It's not like anyone actually ever witnesses or anything these days :)

So, my opinion of Christians has to deal specificaly with those that I could tell were Christians. I could have gotten thousands of really nice Christians, but had no way of telling that they were. A lot of times, the really nice people used language that would at least disqualify them as Southern Baptists (because we all know that they NEVER cuss, right?).

I think also that most non-Christians I knew had the same image of all Christians - never drink, never smoke, never cuss, and always leave a tract or try to convert you on the spot. If a person ordered a beer, no one would believe they were a Christian. This is not a "it's okay to drink and not get drunk" issue I am throwing out. It's just that I have been in arguments before where a friend of mine would come in and order a beer and then NONE of my co-workers would believe that he went to church. They just couldn't beleive it.

Maybe it just comes down to being that those of us who do treat our waiters with respect never do anything to identify ourselves as Christians, which I know I never do.

One thing I'll say,
Our memories work like the press looking for newstories. We don't remember "dog bites man". We only remember "man bites dog". It's the unusual that makes us notice. The only T-shirts you'll notice at the mall that people are wearing are the bizarre ones.

That said, being mistreated at a Metallica concert? Not newsworthy. And it doesn't stand out in a memory.

But at Amy Grant? It is counter expectations so we notice.

My point is simply that people are going to notice more when Christians behave badly. Because we are expected to behave well (as we should). But just because we hear an anecdotal story about Christians acting like jerks, doesn't mean that the majority act like jerks.

Similar to another thinkling, I was mistreated by some pastors when I was working at Baptist bookstore. But you know what? I was mistreated by regular schmoes too. It's the Pastors I remember because it stands out. (But I think that the majority of pastors are wonderful, decent people. I also think that the good ones may have a bad day now and then.)

I too have always heard that Christians are bad tippers, but really I think we just notice that sort of thing. That punk rockers or biker gangs or middle schoolers are bad tippers is not the sort of thing that would stand out in our memories. But if it's a christian or a nun or something, we remember that!

Thanks, Matt and Philip.

I don't know. I can't avoid the negative anecdotes - they are everywhere.

It really makes me wonder. Seriously - this is a big issue - for me at least.

I've never heard a real good explanation for any of this. But if these anecdotes are true: why are any of us Christians?

I don't mean that the way it came out. I am a Christian by faith (calvinists, please don't jump all over that - not time for that argument). But I became a Christian, in part, because I knew, by faith, that I would become a better, more loving, more forgiving, more gracious person.

But if the majority of Christians aren't that way (and I can't exclude myself from that majority - I'm one too and have no reason to believe I'm perceived any different in a restaurant. Notice how none of us think we're the problem?) then it kind of puts a lie to the sanctification promises we are given in the Bible, doesn't it?

Don't hear me wrong - I believe with all my heart that the Bible is true, that sanctification is real, and that this, by definition, means Christians on the whole are more Godly than non-Christians.

But this one simple topic really shakes that belief. We shouldn't even have to try - if we are truly more like Christ from the inside-out, unconsiously people should sense that and see it.

In other words, we should be surprised by the anecdotes about how much people like serving the church crowd, not the opposite.

This drives me crazy . . .

Also - I was never a waiter, but I did work behind the counter for several years at an Eckerd's in San Antonio right down the street from a big Baptist church. I remember those few instances where someone somehow self-identified as a Christian with nothing but positive memories. Such as the lady who let me know I had given her back too much money, or the friendly youth minister who talked to me as I rang up his purchases.

But that's it for me, frankly. The few months I bussed tables when I was a teen I didn't work at a place that served lunch.

Troubled . . .

It's not just rude Christians (or customers in general) who tip poorly. I waited tables on a church couple that were treating a native missionary couple to dinner. They spent the dinner openly discussing the state of foreign missions and their church's involvement. They thanked me for every refill, but left only cents over the bill.

I appreciated their patience and kindness, and made an effort to serve them well because it was a pleasure to wait on them. It would have been ideal if not for the pocket change.

I work retail. A home improvement store and I have to say that the Christians are much more likely to be patient. I work in a stressful area and some times you need to listen and just wait. They do. I’ve been cussed at my machines have been kicked and slammed and cussed at. The Christians call me sister and honey. They shake my hand and give me hugs. I’ve been offered dinner and sodas. By far I’d rather wait on the man dressed in his Sunday best then the guy who felt fixing it right now was more important then going to church. However, they get encouragement from me because I’m called to love them all.

Since I left the last comment about pizza and Amy Grant concerts I figured I ought to weigh in.

This was MY experience with people but I've heard it from a lot of other people who've served.

We shouldn’t even have to try - if we are truly more like Christ from the inside-out, unconsiously people should sense that and see it.

Yeah, you're right, but many of us, many times, AREN'T like Christ from the inside-out.

I just know that when I went to a person's house that had a plaque like the one I mentioned or 'Jesus Junk' everywhere, I knew I wasn't getting a tip. They were mostly nice, just no tip. Nice didn't pay for my school, tips did.

;-)

As for the Amy Grant show, I don't know. That was THAT guy's experience. I think it might have been that this particular crowd were not knowledgeable of the "rules" of concert parking and going to concerts in general at venues like an ampitheater. I really don't know though.

I am a chef (not a cuurent practicing ne, mind you).

Though I never had the opportunity to wait on tables on a Sunday afternoon, I always knew when the church crowd came in, even from the "back of the house." The waitstaff became very "harrassed and helpless." I never attributed this to it being the church crowd's "fault", but simply that everyone just got busy. The adrenaline would start flowing, and tempers can often flare up during those times.

Now that I think about it, I can only attribute this to the expectations being high from the church crowd.

Now, I will contrast that with a third shift "bar rush" (that is the 1:30AM rush after the area bars close). The waitstaff was much more relaxed and easy going during this rush, the waiting lines for which could easily equal a Sunday afternoon, and sometimes surpass it.

So what made the difference? Well, for one, if you made mistakes with the bar rush crowd, they were much more willing to forgive and just go with it. And for another thing, the quality of the food presentation went WAY WAY down for that rush. The customers did not care what it looked like. They had the muchies, and if the food looked like "pig slop" they didn't care a hoot. So the food went out faster, the waitstaff stayed relaxed, and the tips tended to be much larger!

It seems to me that the difference is the expectations between the church crowd and the bar rush crowd. This is just my experience, though.

I meant to mention that my experience as a Christian customer in a restaurant seems to conflict with De's hearings.

When I go to a restaurant, I make an extreme effort to keep the wait(er/ess) relaxed, and especially if I go during the peak times.

If the service is bad, it will more than likely be that the server is having a tough day. If that is the case, I will still leave 15% tip. But normally I will leave a 20% tip even if the service was only "what is expected" from a server. And on occassion I will come across a server who doesn't care a hoot about my party. If it interferes with my enjoyment, that server will get a small tip...maybe 3%...and perhaps a bad review.

"I meant to mention that my experience as a Christian customer in a restaurant seems to conflict with De’s hearings."

That's good to hear Danny.

But troubling too. Most everyone is saying the same thing: "Christians are a pain to serve in a restaurant" - and then following that up with "Of course, I'm a Christian and I try my best to be a joy to serve in a restaurant".

I would hazard to guess that almost everyone who has commented on either of these threads tries to be courteous to servers and tip well.

But I have yet to hear one story (just one!) from a server telling of a Christian they served who was BOTH courteous AND tipped well. I've heard several stories of how they were very courteous but left lousy tips, and about a million stories about how they were both rude and cheap.

In other words, the problem is, evidently, all around us and yet somehow, all of us here (all present company) are the blessed exception to the rule.

I know enough about statistics to know that that's just not the way things work.

"Yeah, you’re right, but many of us, many times, AREN’T like Christ from the inside-out."

Yes, Daniel.

But is it strange that we are even less like Christ than those who don't know Him at all? Does that compute?

It doesn't compute with me.

No, it doesn't compute and it's a bad thing. That's why we have to ALWAYS keep in mind that we need to act like Christ no matter where we are or what we are doing.

I'm sure I delivered pizzas to Christians who did tip well, they just never had outward expressions of their faith like the Jesus Junk on their door.

Thanks Daniel,

And I'm probably belaboring this point (I do that sometimes). But I find the almost universal negative view of Christians in this area to be very, very troubling, if it's clear view of what's really going on. It would mean that in some fundamental areas of human kindness becoming a Christian could actually make you a worse person than an unbeliever.

I have a hard time shrugging it off as "well, we have to do better, don't we?". I'm not saying you're shrugging it off, but no one seems to have a good answer on this question.

To restate an earlier observation, I'm waiting to hear a story of just one person who at one time served a Christian who was both kind and tipped well. No one has been able to remember even a single instance, thus far.

Call us fundamentalists, but we just don't think we should go out to eat on Sunday at all. Or transact any other business that's not absolutely necessary. That would solve the problem too.

Your point is valid, De. I would venture a guess that my desire to "do well" for the server could be based on my compassion for them, having been in the industry. But I would like to think that being a Christian has something to do with it.

A long time ago I was a server for a large hotel that catered large banquets. One evening we served a group of Christian businessmen and things really did not go well. The food was late, everybody was running behind; frankly, the hotel was not doing its job well.

The person who had hired the hotel was (of course) stressed and unhappy with the service that he was getting (half an hour before the guests were due to arrive we were still setting up tables (not setting tables).

One of the other servers made a comment something like "these guys are Christians, you'd think they'd be more patient".

I'd seen guys way more impatient with way less reason - but the "Christian" label earned this group greater scrutiny.

I'm just relating that because it may be that sometimes Christians are held to a higher standard, or that we are judged more harshly than a non-Christian might be.

My best friend & I have gotten into the habit of giving a little extra when our server has gone above and beyond the call of duty. The "little extra" is partially in the way of an increased tip (greater than 20%), but one step further.

We came to the realization that, all too often, the only time a manager is summoned to a table is because the service has been particularly unacceptable. But what about the unusually stellar?

This is when we started asking our attentive server to get their manager for us after they bring us our check. The manager is told, in no uncertain detail, how well the server did and how that impacts our elevated perception of the restaurant.

It stuns both the manager and the server. We're leaving a wake of stunned, happy people in our neck of the woods. Among other things, we are called to be encouragers. I don't recall any passage in the Bible that restricts encouragement only to the saved.

To piggyback on what Ellen posted, non-Christians in general watch what we do and say a bit more critically when we publically label ourselves as Christians.

I realize that the solution is a little too black & white (and somewhat harsh) for the gray world we live in but, in my mind, the answer is simple. If you're going to call yourself a Christian, then do your darndest to behave like Christ - not just to the church but to the world around you. If you're not going to put in the effort, please don't use that label and spare the rest of us any embarrassment.

We have a friend at church whom we often go out to eat with, and my husband has adopted his tipping habit which ALWAYS guarantees awesome service. He starts out giving the server a $10 bill, before they even take our order. Now, realize that we have 3 kid, they have 2, all 8 and under, so it is quite the zoo to serve and any server deserves that tip and more! After he gets the bill, if the tip should be more, he'll tip more -- or if we're combining the bills we'll chip in our part of the tip as well. Of course this guy is a used car salesman (an honest one, can you believe it?!), they're famous for grand gestures.

De, thanks for bringing up Jared's post on tipping. I don't have wisdom on why Christians can be jerks in this area (during college I waited tables and had the same experience with a few Christians who left tracts instead of tips and I was already a Christian!).

I do have a question that some readers and Alan touched on in the previous post-- what is appropriate for the the buffet? My take is that if I am to tip 15-20% in a "normal" restaurant, but at a buffet establishment I am doing 90-95% of the work done by a waiter at a "normal" restaurant, why don't I tip myself? Why would I pay a waiter 15-20% for bringing a glass of water and napkins when I pay a waiter at a normal restaurant that much for doing ALL the work?

I think the fundamental principle that needs to be considered on this topic is the principle of grace and generosity. When it comes to the resturaunt table, many Christians forget (either conciously or unconciously) that the money they have is simply a blessing from the Lord. We tithe 10% because we are simply giving back a portion of what we truly owe Him. I think the same principle applies with tipping. Should we not pass on the blessing that Christ has given to us? Should we not tip despite less than perfect service? If Christ gave us all what we deserved, we would all be going to hell. If we give our servers what they deserve or less than they deserve we seem to be telling the server that we serve a God who is purely just and matter of fact in areas of blessing. If we really want to communicate the Gospel to our non-Christian server, we should be showing them how overly generous our God is, not leaving them a tract to pay lip service to who we serve. We need to put our money where our mouth is. Only then can we really attempt to show that our God is more generous and full of grace than those idols that the world worships when they tip better than us Christians.

My theory is that the majority of people who've had bad experiences with Christians and their tipping only know that they've served Christians because the Christians made some sort of outward statement. Servers, like when i delivered pizza in college, probably have served thousands of Christians that DID tip and were nice people but they didn't know they had served a Christian because the Christian didn't leave a tract or have Jesus fish or other stuff that outwardly labeled them a Christian.

Of course, that's just my theory.

Well, your theory might have some merit. Although it assumes some kind of correlation between outward displays of faith and stinginess.

That's what I find a bit troubling about this debate. Most people who've commented here seem to feel like they are part of the solution, not part of the problem. They tip well and are courteous. I know that I have always strived to be courteous, and after these discussions on tipping I've been really concentrating more on over-tipping. I'm sure many of you do too.

I find it hard to believe that none of the good-tippers who have commented here ever display any sign of their faith. You don't pray before meals? If your church is a more formal church, do you show up on Sunday at lunch dressed like you've come from church? To be blunt, you don't seem to be getting much credit (and a positive witness) for your generosity.

Are people who read this blog somehow more generous and polite than your average non-blogging churchgoer?

Or are we not doing as well as we think?

Jesus said that we would be known by our fruit. Where's our fruit in this area? It's easy to talk about Christians like they are "others", even though we are Christians ourselves. I have yet to get one positive counter-example from a restaurant worker in this comment thread regarding this topic.

De,

It is probably better said that "sheltered people" tip poorly, people who know how the world works tip well.

Some people, Christians or not, just don't know the standard, which you laid out well in your post.

However, my personal experience is that the category of people who don't know the standard is largely inhabited by the Sunday Brunch church crowd. Who knows if they're Christians? All we know is that they go to church. I waited tables all thru college and dreaded the Sunday afternoon shift for this specific reason. I think its fairly universal.

I understand your frustration though. Not tipping well and not being respectful is inconsistent with Christian character. What's the deal?

I think generally, or at least comparatively, we Christians are more careful with our money and don't go out as much. Not many of us are "winers and diners". We don't run in those circles, so we don't tend to hear about/keep up with the standard.

Secondly, I think that the most miserable people on the face of the earth are the Christian legalists (who I would not call Christians). They're high-maintanance, demanding, and just plain miserable to be around. There are still churches out there full of people like this, and many flock to restaurants on Sunday after church.

These two contribute to the overall Sunday afternoon thing.

I've worked in retail for years. And it seems that it doesn't matter whether people are Christians or not. Some people are rude and some people are nice regardless of their religious professions. I find just as many rude and nice people within the church as from without. It seems to me that manners have been forgotten in this current generation. And there's something about professing what one believes without having to live up to that profession that seems to be going on in the world today - whether Christian or some other religion.

And as for the Sunday lunch issue... my husband and I rarely go out to eat on Sunday because we are tired and cranky. We go home after church, eat leftovers for lunch and then nap. I don't understand the big need to go out for lunch after church on Sundays. It's so much more enjoyable to go out to eat when it is relaxed and meant as a social event.

cranky?........after church?........hmmmmm.....Anita might have uncovered the answer.

And another thought... what's with our country and tipping anyway? Other countries frown on tipping as being weird. Why can't we just pay our employees to work and forget the whole tip issue altogether?

As a rule, we tip right down the average middle, not being stingy nor being extravagant. There's hardly a service anymore that doesn't expect some sort of tip, from hotel housekeeping, to hairdressers, and more. Why is that? Can I have a tip for just being a good customer?

"cranky?……..after church?……..hmmmmm…..Anita might have uncovered the answer."

Well, this was one of the theories of my waiter friend (the one I talked to and which conversation prompted this post).

Anita also made a great point about the disconnect between what we profess and how we act.

I think churches should preach on how we should treat servers.

I think churches should preach on how we should treat servers

Now this is the most brilliant thing posited in this convo, from my perspective.
It wouldn't even have to be "preachign" on that. But if more ministers might say a few words to the congregation just as part of the general dismissal at the end of the service, it might do a world of difference.
Imagine if pastors, when dismissing the congregation after the final worship song or benediction or whatever, said something like, "Thanks, everyone, for coming today. Hope you have a great and restful rest of the day. And if you're eating out, don't forget to treat your servers like Jesus would."

something that simple might work wonders

Jared cont'd...."........and try the veal!"

I think Philip's point in Comment #2 was not fully appreciated. My older brother used to talk about what he called "Statistics by Observation." The classic sports example is this. Guy makes a great defensive play in the field in a baseball game for the third out. Then, when his team comes up to bat, the same guy is the lead off hitter for that half-inning. Now, the incidence of the guy making the great defensive play being the first hitter shoud occur about 1 out of every 9 times, and I'd be willing to guess that given a large enough sample, the actual number would tend very close to that.

However, when the guy is the lead-off hitter, you can count on the game commentators pointing it out with a line like "It seems like everytime someone makes a great play, he is first to bat when his team comes up." What the commentators are forgetting are the other 8 out of 9 times that a player made a great play but wasn't the lead-off hitter.

How this relates to Phiilip's comment is this. Perhaps, 88.9% of Christian customers are courteous and decent to good tippers, but that 11.1% is going to be what is remembered. I also think it has to do with going against expectations. Christians are expected to be nicer than most and more patient than most, so when we aren't it really stands out.

Now, given the stereotype that has developed over the years about Christian customers, perhaps the instances of good tipping from Christian customers should stand out more, but most likely most Christians who are eating out (on Sunday afternoon or any other time) don't do much to distinguish themselves from the others eating in the restaurant, so even if they are good tipping Christians, it goes unnoticed.

And, the instances of bad tipping Christians, which probably is even lower that the 11.1% I used as an example, are now seen merely as proof that the stereotype is correct.

Calvinator, I think your predicted stats would bear out to be true. However, a key issue here is the "Sunday church crowd". I never for a moment ever assume that necessarily means "Christians".

88+% of true believers likely tip well.......however, I would argue that a FAR LOWER percentage of the Sunday Church crowd does.....and I'd also argue that's because the 2 are not necessarily the same.

Blaming it on the Sunday church crowd, huh?

*@&#$% Seventh-day Adventists.

De-

We just don't get it.

Thirsty Bear,

Thanks, but what do you mean? You say "we" just don't get it. Yet I remember from the other thread that you take great pains to both tip very well and be courteous. So who's the "we"?

This is an issue I have with many of the more critical posts in the Christian blogosphere. I call them "PCE" posts ("Present Company Excepted") - they generally complain about how dumb/stingy/not-well-read/jerkish "Christians" are, yet no one reading or writing those posts ever feels like they are part of the problem.

I'm pretty sure that you get it, based on your comments. OK, what makes you special? How about Danny Kaye? What makes him special? I've eaten out with Jared and the other Thinklings - tipped well and were nice. Are we somehow just different/better than other Christians?

I doubt it, frankly.

Who's not getting it?

I have an example of the Christians who were nice and tipped well. A couple and their son came several times a year to the resort I worked at. They were openly Christian, often came with a Dobson, and were associated with Focus on the Family and National Day of Prayer. They brightened a room otherwise filled with impossible to please North-Hollywood customers, tipped on the bill, and at the end of their stay always left a tip envelope for every person that had served them during their stay, from housekeeping to cooks. We looked forward to their coming every trip.

And the reason Europeans look down on tipping is the tip is factored into the bill already.

I am not the greatest tipper. I'll admit it. I usually try not to be tight with the tip either, unless the job was done poorly.

Daniel-Our Pizza delivery guys make a couple of bucks higher than minimum wage, way more than the waitress. Also, when we are charged for delivary $2 or $3, I don't feel as if I should owe a tip to the guy. He's making more then double of most waitresses. That is here in our neck of the woods, I'm not sure about yours.

Danny Kaye-From experience, the bar crowd was usually a little looser with thier cash, but from my brother in law's experience, when you are even a little lit, the money runs quicker through the fingers, the girls look a little better, and the food isn't as bad. That isn't always the case, just his experience.

I once new a Christian man that used to start our with 10 dimes on the table. Anytime the waitress or waiter didn't do something he asked, or was rude, he took a dime away. Whatever was left, was the tip. You have to consider that was 12 or so years ago. Still, we couldn't believe he did it then. We cracked up laughing.

When I was waitressing, Sundays or Not, I always made more than minimum wage with my tips, and sometimes way more.

One thing that sticks out to me, is that now, tipping is "expected" in a lot of professions. Now if I pay a quality price for something and get a quality job or less then, why should I pay a tip? Come on, when a hair cut, or a trim even, cost upwards to $60, I don't feel inclined to have to tip that person. Especially if it took them say 30 minutes. That's a great per hour set up, even if you have to pay booth rental.

One thing I do know, if I don't have enough to leave a tip, I shouldn't go to a food establishment that expects one.


Other questions linger in my brain.

Do some waiters expect more than they deserve?

I was told by my boss that if my tips didn't add up to at least minimum wage, I was supposed to turn in a sheet and they would make up the difference. They didn't want anyone starving out on $2.00 an hour. Is it still the same today?

Should you still tip your waiter up to 20% if you are eating at a buffett, and drinking water from the pitcher the hostess brought to your table?

Do most people tip the cook for the great job he/she did? Is that normal?

My mother in law has been a cook most of her life. She taught me that if your meal was good to call out the cook and let them know, and even give them a dollar or two.

I guess you should know also that one of my pet peeves is that if they don't like thier jobs, they should get one that they enjoy. There is nothing worse than getting helped (in ANY business) by someone that doesn't want to do it.

A couple of thoughts on a thread that's probably dead.

De's conundrum is that Christian's should always be in the process of becoming sanctified, so not tipping is a sign that the sanctification promises aren't being met. My take is that the people who are *obviously* Christian, i.e. talk a lot about it and give you tracts, are primarily immature Christians. The sanctification process hasn't had time to work for them. So these 'loudmouth' Christians create the impression that Christians are bad tippers, because mature Christians (who tip better) don't broadcast their religion as much.

Margaret, minimum wage doesn't cut it. It's not a Christian's duty to make sure that service personnel remain poor. Not to mention that pizza delivery people (my son is one) have to pay their own car expenses, except maybe for a token payment from the pizza place that doesn't begin to even cover gas any more. And for your "Christian" man with the dimes to go through the process of publicly humiliating an overworked, underpaid guy or gal who's just trying to get by, all done to the tittering amusement of the table . . . Words fail me.

"And for your “Christian” man with the dimes to go through the process of publicly humiliating an overworked, underpaid guy or gal who’s just trying to get by, all done to the tittering amusement of the table . . . Words fail me."

I agree, that's unbelievable.

I'd take the doublequotes off of the word Christian though - I have no reason to doubt the guy's salvation, just wonder what on earth he's thinking. Plus, I would imagine that after a time or two in a restaurant the "dimes guy" who's max tip was a measly dollar would be risking having some interesting items baked into his meals (bugs, human spit, etc . . .)

And Rachel, thanks for the positive example. That's a neat story.

Let me correct something

The Christian guy didn't do it for the amusement of the table. We were not there when it happened. He did that when he and his family when out to eat. That was something he told us. Now, we did inform him it was cheap, and that at the time, if he was going to continue the practice he should at least start with $2 maybe $3. But to take the label "christian" off of him, that is a little harsh. I'm sure NONE of us here have ever done anything that made us feel later that our Christian witness was shamed or gone. Thank God he is more merciful and graceful than we ever thought of being.

And again with the pizza guy. I know most of the guys here that deliver from the place we get pizza. I've never seen one of them in thier own car. Pizza Hut has an older Ford Taurus that they use as a delivery car. Maybe other places are different.

I do understand that minimum wage doesn't cut it. If I told you of our income, you'd probably fall off your chair asking how we make it. We make it because our God supplies all our needs, no matter if we are working for the almighty minimum wage or not.

Most people even young teens just starting jobs know that minimum wage doesn't cut it. I think if I was delivering pizzas, I'd know I'd have to get something else to help out. In this day, between going to school, college, living expenses and other things that most Americans just can't live without, minimum wage won't go far at all.
I wonder how many of those people just trying to make it are still paying for cigarettes or are still subscribing to some kind of cable TV. I was shocked that when one of my sisters lost her job (and she was responsible for the house payment) cut down her insurance coverage to save a few bucks a month ($40.00) but still never took out the cable. And yes, we knew her situation and people in our family including us were helping her out. We would want to in any situation anyway, but I couldn't believe she kept the cable.

Another question came to mind that seems appropriate for this thread...

How many of these Christians that don't tip 15 or 20%, are faithful to give 10% to the church? If people aren't willing to give God his 1 lifesaver out of a 10 pack, what makes you think they are going to care about giving 20% as a tip?

The minimum wage issue is difficult -- for a good read about it, read "Nickle and Dimed" by Barbara Erenreich. She is a research journalist who tried for several months to make a living at minimum wage. She published a book based on her experience.

The reason people go into waitressing is to guarantee a bit over that. Even so, living in Southern California most people have to work two full time jobs, or one full time and one part time to make ends meet. Many waitressing jobs are seasonal, so they may be making "great money" for part of the year, but have to save almost all of it for the off season.

And to answer why many skilled and educated people choose to wait tables (I have a bachelors degree, and I work with a waitress who went to med school, and a bartender who has a business degree), it offers flexibility that other better paying salaried jobs don't. You may not have benefits, but you can switch shifts with someone to go to the doctor's office during the day.

To answer Margaret's question, I think it is understood in the waiting world that buffet is a different animal altogether. I sometimes work a sunday morning breakfast buffet, and we understand tips at 10% or less because there is very little serving involved. Any situation where you pick up your own food (including carry-out) you needn't feel obligated to tip, but it's sure appreciated if you do!

I would like to mention, we wait people do appreciate tips, even 'lousy' ones because we know no-one has to leave anything, and your tips keep us from needing another job. We really aren't money grubbing, but we do depend on the money. Thanks for all of your tips.

Also, we understand when we get a bad tip if our service isn't good. If we've messed up the order or forgotten refils, etc. But it's really discouraging to have our tips cut for things we can't help. Before you leave a small tip because of "poor service" have you looked around to see, is the restaurant really busy? have you come at peak hours with a large group unannounced? did you ask for separate checks? All of these things affect the service.

"I’d take the doublequotes off of the word Christian though - I have no reason to doubt the guy’s salvation, just wonder what on earth he’s thinking."

You're absolutely right, you too Margaret. I was out of line and regretted it later.

Ok, I'm new to this but wanted to interject my observations as a Christian AND a server. After months of working with the Sunday Christian crowd and getting low tips, I finally told my boss I could no longer work on Sundays because I needed some time with my kids. The truth was, I was so angered by the cheap Christian tippers and I didn't want my faith to become hardened. I honestly do not have a solid answer for why they are bad tippers, but have a few theorys. Christians are taught to tithe 10 percent of their income. Is it possible that they believe they should not leave a server more than they are giving to the Lord, ratio wise? As far as Christians leaving tracts, nothing irritates me more. For months I wondered why I was so angry with the tracts, and then it hit me. I am a Christian! I know where my faith lies, BUT by them leaving a tract on the table they are assuming that I am NOT a Christian. That assumption is what really gets to me. I would love to go to church on Sunday mornings, but I have two kids to support as a single mom and have to work A LOT. Getting bad tips is one thing, but the tracts were a final insult to me. Also, scrolling back I read one of De comments. De said that they never heard a story of a good Christian tipper, and that the only word out there is that they are bad tippers. In the place I work, I see a lot of people who are Christians come in and dine alone or with just their spouse. I know they are Christians becaue I use to work with them at a local Christian organization. On one occasion, a fellow co worker came in to eat and I was the server. This former co worker DID NOT know that I knew him because we never worked in the same department at the Christian organization I use to work at. He proceeded to have two glasses of wine (which I KNOW some other co workers would have shunned) and he left a 20 percent tip. I wish I could say that was the norm, but in two months I watched 12 different former Christian co workers come in to eat and only 1 left a decent tip. The others ALL left 10 percent or left. Even when they recognized me and knew me, engaged in conversation on a personal level, they STILL left horrible tips. I also dine out once in a while with some of my Christian co workers and every time the bill comes I have to leave more for the tip or point out to them that their tip is not adequate. On one recent occasion, a Christian friend asked for a seperate check. Her bill came to 18 dollars and she left ONE DOLLAR for a tip. I kindly pointed out to her that she need to leave AT LEAST 3.60 but she could round it up to 4 bucks. She was so angry that I would even suggest leaving more than 2 dollars, and to round it up to 4 bucks (a measly 40 cents more)had her so angry that she wouldn't speak to me for the rest of the night. I have no idea why it was such a bad topic with her, but what I do know is that it has become very apparent to me that it is NOT a myth or a rumor that Christians are bad tippers. They really are! For those that aren't, I thank you and can only hope that the rest will soon catch on. In the mean time, STOP LEAVING TRACTS ON THE TABLES! Leaving tracts is only going to anger a server and paint Christians in a bad light. I would really like to hear from someone who actually read the tract, studied it's scriptures and became a Christian as a result.

Thanks Allie,

I've polled our singles class and those who have been servers also agreed.

At this point, I can't deny it. Christians are bad tippers. The evidence (albeit, anecdotal) is overwhelming.

I can't explain it. It grieves me. It makes me wonder (seriously) how many of us are truly regenerate. The alternative is to believe sanctification isn't true, and I can't handle that.

By the way, while affirming that Christians tip bad, everyone in my class was quite sure they were always polite and generous :-) Just like everyone here.

I can't explain that either. . .

This whole thing makes me feel lousy.

Also, Allie, I apologize on behalf of Sunday eat-out Christians for the crummy tips you've gotten.

We've got to do better.

De you are too kind! If memory serves, I have only had two Christian familys that were rude. The majority of them are kind. I no longer work where I had to put up with bad tips from Christians, as I have moved up to a five star place where people tip 20 percent or more at least 99 percent of the time. I had one very interesting and discouraging thing happen at my new place however. I served two couples and one of the couples worked at "Focus on the Family" (I live in Colorado Springs). Well, to make a long story short, these two couples ran up a bill close to $400. (Remember, this is a fancy shmancy 5 star joint). Well, turns out the head chef was a distant relation to other man in this four top of two couples and he comped the ENTIRE meal. Both couples were so amazed and appreciative and the man (who is related to the chef) reached in his pocket and handed me some cash and said "In all the excitment, I can't forget to tip you." Both couples then walked out the door and then it hit me, "Mr. Focus on the Family" did not leave me ONE DIME twords the tip. He just got his $400 meal comped (which he TRIED to pay for before it was comped), he then watched his friend reach in and hand me some cash, and he did not offer so much as ONE DOLLAR to me for my tip. He had no idea how much is friend gave and so even though I made a nice tip off the meal, I was highly discouraged that this man did not even so much as offer to help with the tip or offer his own tip. So yes, it is sad, I agree with you totally. As annoying as it is, your friends are right in that they are not rude and they are kind, for the most part. I guess it could be worse, they could continue tipping the way they do and then top it off with rudeness or an insult.

Thanks Allie

Not to defend the patron you mention, but if someone comped my whole meal and also let me know that they had "taken care of the tip too" I would probably have done the same thing. Partly out of a desire to not appear to be saying "Well, thanks a lot! But you probably didn't tip very well, did you?" - and partly because I would have been going "Woohoo!!!" in my head :-)

In other words, it's one of those rare situations. There's not much time to think through things, and if someone's generously pulling out cash to tip the waiter for you it might seem kind of awkward to also be reaching for my own wallet.

Of course, I wasn't there. :-)

It's cool that you're working in a nice restaurant with good tips now.