"The first and most important thing to say about John Dominic Crossan's work is that it is bad history."

- D.A. Carson
Christians and Electronic Thievery

Glenn Lucke on illegal downloads:

My own experience in discussing this topic with students, including Christian students? Overwhelmingly they refuse to stop stealing, even when they acknowledge that they have stolen. I engaged literally hundreds of students about this topic at UVa, and after all the discussing, two root reasons would emerge from the students: 1) I can (technology enables me) and 2) I want to.

With a few exceptions, Christian students engaged in the same stealing, and deployed the same anti-Christian reasoning. One student finally became persuaded that it was stealing, so resolved to steal no more, but wouldn't pay for the 1,000+ songs she had already stolen, nor delete them.

Again, with a few exceptions, the only way to make a dent in the Christian students? Tell them of my personal friendship with Caedmons Call, and how Caedmon's band members related to me their perspective about having their hundreds of hours of hard work taken from them for free. Then the students would say, "Oh. Well, I won't download their stuff. I'll buy their stuff."

Meaning, these students were incapable of submitting themselves to abstract principle, but, if they felt some sentiment for a personal connection, then they might adjust their behavior. Effectively, the Ten Commandments only had force in their lives if they had positive sentiment for the person wronged in a violation of the Commandments.

Some reader will write in, as often happens here, and defend this state of affairs.

It happens almost every time we discuss it here, as well. In a post on lawsuits about four years ago, one commenter even suggested, should I ever be published, it'd be okay to buy a copy of my book that was illegally photocopied by someone selling his copies cheaper.

"I can" and "I (might) want to" was in full effect there, and the concerns of the artist (me!) over supporting his family with his work wasn't in play.

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Comments on "Christians and Electronic Thievery":
1. Quaid - 02/27/2008 8:22 am CST

I'll admit that I was in that category, too, until ITunes came out. When that happened, I pretty much stopped downloading. Since then, my computer with all my songs on it went the way of the Raptors, so I don't really benefit from my years of "thievery".

I think that musical artists are often seen as overly-compensated and well-off enough to withstand one download. It's also easy to hurt someone you can't see (and who can't see you). [Exhibit B: The blogosphere]

2. Brian in Fresno - 02/27/2008 10:25 am CST

I think it is interesting that there is only one comment on this. I steal time and resources from my employer. I know of a pastor's wife who goes across the street to make photo copies with the churches resources for personal purposes. This is a huge widespread problem that we want to sweep under the rug. It is sin. One little piece of paper is a sin. Sin is the expected behavior. The website of the newspaper I work at gets a great number of hits during the week and nosedives on the weekends. My looking at this site at work is a sin. I do as little as I can on the web at work. Sometimes I do nothing and sometimes I check the web a lot. I'm thankful for God's grace, but we can't presume the grace of God.

3. Brian in Fresno - 02/27/2008 10:48 am CST

I should add that digital thievery is probably a larger problem as the technology adds a layer of abstraction to the whole thing which essentially takes us a step farther back from what we are really doing. It also makes taking something that doesn't belong to us much, much easier as everything is so readily available.

4. Thirsty Bear - 02/27/2008 11:02 am CST

Stealing is stealing. I have a friend that hasn't paid for a movie ticket in over 5 years. He's proud of it. It angers me. I reject his offerings for free movies and downloads. It drives me crazy.

5. stroke - 02/27/2008 11:26 am CST

it's more than digital downloads and paperclips. what about speeding (more prevalent among Christians, i'm sure, than illegal downloads)? is that off limits because it's not in the big ten? how many offenses have we marginalized over the years because of culture? laziness at home or work as BiF mentioned. knowing the good we ought to do and not doing it, etc.

6. Milly - 02/27/2008 2:30 pm CST

How do you get free movie tickets?

Ummm just wondering.

We all have lines that we seem to have no problem crossing some of those lines hurt others. You're right stealing is stealing.

7. Jared - 02/27/2008 2:42 pm CST

Milly, I took that to mean that Thirsty Bear's friend is illegally downloading movies.

8. Lauren - 02/28/2008 7:36 pm CST

wow. instant conviction. I've never illegally downloaded, but I have burned copies of cds. and it amounts to the same thing = music I didn't pay for. well, its all gone now.

9. Raindream - 02/28/2008 8:55 pm CST

What Glenn says is terrible, but I can believe it. I don't think it all of time, and others think of it even less. I work in a ministry, and one of our leaders asked me if I knew how he could rip out a portion of a movie to upload to YouTube so that he could have an easier avenue for showing that portion to a small group the next day. I didn't give it a bit of thought. He owned the movie and wanted to use YouTube or another way to que it up for showing a portion of it. Both ripping it and showing it to a small group are not legal under current copyright.

10. Crossbow - 03/02/2008 2:37 am CST

Actually, Raindream, showing it probably was legal, since most church small groups tend to be educational in nature (even though many are kind of light in that area) - and Fair Use would apply. My employer just recently held a Fair Use seminar, and it sounds like this instance would meet the four criteria for Fair Use exclusion. Of course, sharing it on YouTube does not fall under that.... and also seems kind of excessive and unnecessary. Surely someone had a DVD player or laptop with a DVD drive that could have played the clip. Queuing it up right before the group meeting would have taken less time than ripping and uploading it and all.

I preached a sermon recently where I wanted to use a clip from Joan of Arcadia. I researched and found that public presentations do have considerable latitude to use small clips once.

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