Thank you, Jared. This term burns my biscuits every time I hear it.

On top the excellent point made here, I think someone who calls himself a Jesus follower has to be
1) completely ignorant of or indifferent to the implications of the language he is using, or
2) absolutely arrogant.

I mean, think about it. A "Jesus follower" should be "one who follows Jesus," one who goes where Jesus goes and does what Jesus does. Who comes close? It's a great complement to give to someone else, but to take it for oneself is dangerous, in my eye. You're either "dumbing down" what it means to live like Jesus, or you're inflating your own sense of your own goodness.

"But when people say this about themselves, they don't mean to imply that they are all perfect and everything. They just mean --"
No. See point number 1) above.

Maybe I'm wrong, but doesn't Christian mean "Christlike or little Christ"? I think that sounds more arrogant than Christ follower. I guess I don't see the difference in the two. But again, maybe I'm wrong.(probably);-)

Yeah, I don't care if people call themselves "Jesus follower." I have done it myself.

I think what Abraham is getting at -- and what I've ranted about before -- is that this label is a trend among some as a way of marking themselves off from other Christians.

Anyone remember those "Christian vs. Christ-follower" Mac/PC parody ads? I thought they were horrendous. They were basically saying "Christians wear suits and listen to CCM and are dorky, while we Christ-followers are cool and young and listen to U2."
It was a way of trying to rehab the Church's PR by distancing themselves from fellow Christians.

That's why I called it reverse Pharisaism. "I thank you God that I'm not like those lame, embarrassing Christians . . ."

Paul said something about this stuff. Something like "Can the hand say to the rest of the body, I have no need of you?" (my par.)

Oh, also, Bill wrote a great post about this stuff somewhere in the archives called "I Have Identified The Problem, and it is You." I think that's what it was called, anyway.

I don't know, I'm not uncomfortable with the distinction, or maybe at least that there needs to be some distinction between the:

"Christians" who threw their stick in the fire at church camp when they were 12, and consider themselves "saved" BECAUSE of that event

- and the -

The "Christian" who calls himself a Christ follower and by that mean that he is "seeking to work out my salvation TODAY, and I hope that His Spirit will continue to testify to my spirit that I am his child"

I agree that a church that calls themselves a "body of Christ followers" should have evidence of that claim before they put it on their mission statement.

As a side - "reverse pharisaism" makes me think of the "reverse peep-hole" which Kramer (Seinfeld) had installed on his front door so that he could look in and see if anyone was waiting inside to ambush him with a sock full of pennies..........probably just me.

nhe, a distinction by way of label?

Don't we already have those? (Backsliders, cheap grace, "Christian in name only," etc.)

When I see this line drawn it has little to nothing to do with walked-the-aisle Christians who don't live out their faith. It is usually about trying to distinguish between "traditional" Christians or Christians who aren't cool or who have the misfortune of being old and Christians who are younger and think they're more relevant.

Well said, Jared.

(also, the post you referred to is here, for anyone interested in reading it)

I have to say that Jesus follower has a bit more humility these days than what most people perceive in "Christian." I use it a lot. A lot. Because I talk to a lot of non-Christians in my ministry, and Jesus follower takes down a pretty big wall.

I have to wonder if "Calvinist" is a term to separate us from other believers?

The word "Christian" means one thing to the church, and another to the American public. I think that within the church it's probably just nit-picky (or worse) to distinguish between "Christian" and "Christ-follower". However, in the general American culture, the word "Christian" has lost nearly all real meaning, and has in fact almost come to be synonymous with the "White Anglo-Saxon Protestant" label thrown on most Americans. This may be changing, but it still seems that everyone (at least in high school...maybe college changes this) still considers themselves "Christians". And so I think that in this context it's not inappropriate to call ourselves "Christ-followers". I know that we tend toward arrogance (or at least I know that I do), but I think such a distinction can be made without falling into the trap of modern Pharisaism. The term "Christ-follower" communicates essentially the same thing as "evangelical Christian" does, or at least did--namely, a commitment to be sold out to the Gospel, and ultimately to Christ.


The reason I started calling myself a a "Christ-follower" instead of a Christian is that the latter carries with it mainly the connotation of a conservative, moral church-goer. But I believe there's more than that, and I want to communicate that Christ demands our all. So when I say that I'm a Christ-follower, I don't mean that I have it all together--far from it. Rather, I am simply stating that I believe Christ to be preeminent and supreme in all things, and that I strive to make this true in my life. It is the declaration that all of my heart, soul, mind, body, and time--all of my self--belongs to Christ, and to Him alone. It says that I believe He is the Way, the Truth, and the Life.


Either way, though, thanks for this reminder to examine my heart before God in all that I do, so that I do not become arrogant and self-righteous. I fall into that a lot.

I have to say that Jesus follower has a bit more humility these days than what most people perceive in "Christian." I use it a lot. A lot. Because I talk to a lot of non-Christians in my ministry, and Jesus follower takes down a pretty big wall.

I have to wonder if "Calvinist" is a term to separate us from other believers?

I guess I disagree Jared.....even though I don't like labels, I do understand and appreciate the distinction between Christ follower and Christian.........follower doesn't sound "cool" to me, it just seems to be a clearer distinction. Christian has come to mean "saved".....where Christ follower denotes "actively following Jesus".......there are plenty of people I know of who would be fine with being called a Christian, but who would take issue with calling themselves a Christ follower - the latter wants something from them that they never signed on for.

Can we all agree, though, that the "Christ Follower" vs. "Christian" videos were hideous, and that many people who distance themselves from the label "christian" also have an agenda to not be associated with the rest of us who still carry that label?

there are plenty of people I know of who would be fine with being called a Christian, but who would take issue with calling themselves a Christ follower - the latter wants something from them that they never signed on for

Really?
I mean, I know there are people who call themselves Christians who don't follow Christ. I know them myself.
But I think any one of them wouldn't hesitate to call themselves "followers of Jesus," as well.

I think one trait of cheap gracers is self-delusion and obliviousness. I can't imagine any of them actually acknowledging, "Oh, I just want God for the fire insurance." They're not self-aware like that.

Bottom line for me is that both labels have biblical roots, so either is fine with me as labels.

But as dividing lines between "we real Christians" and "those fake ones," I hate the very idea.

One of the reasons, btw, I still like and use the label "evangelical." (Not the only reason, but one of them.)

I have to wonder if "Calvinist" is a term to separate us from other believers?

It can be.

Lots of labels can be, can't they?
Post-evangelical comes to mind. :-)

I also think we're giving "the world" way too much credit for being able to differentiate.

I think that within the church it's probably just nit-picky (or worse) to distinguish between "Christian" and "Christ-follower". However, in the general American culture, the word "Christian" has lost nearly all real meaning

But you have to explain this. When someone not up on the church lingo of relevancy hears "Christ-follower," they will 9 out of 10 times just hear "Christian" anyway.

I wish we'd give up the PR game and just start loving people -- Christian and non-.

I wish we'd give up the PR game and just start loving people -- Christian and non-.

Hammer. Nail. Bam.

yeah, Jared, I do know some people like that.....my brother in law for one........he'd be perfectly cool with "Christian" but if you called him a "Christ follower" it would weird him out. Its not about them thinking "I've got fire insurance, I'm good" as much as it that being a Christian is synonymous with being a republican, but being a "Christ follower" to them would be like being in the John Birch Society - too extreme.

I wish we'd give up the PR game and just start loving people -- Christian and non-.

...Doesn't the Bible even say something along those lines a couple of times? :)

I wish we'd give up the PR game and just start loving people -- Christian and non-.

Point taken.