When I read the article about the challenge my first thought was, "How many women were involved in the planning discussions?" I'm thinking none. And yes, ew.

Ok, just read Krusty's post. The best comment:

Shout to the Lord!

Bom-Chicka-Wah-Wah!

Crying and laughing.

Why doesn't the 30-day marital/family scripture study challenge get any national press?

I haven't read the story, and from the 'ew' comments, it doesn't seem to be something that is worth my time.

"Why doesn't the 30-day marital/family scripture study challenge get any national press?"

Because there are lots of them.

And they aren't...er....new.

Also, they don't read like the transcript of a morbid train-wreck.

When I was married, I would have loved this! I sat under a pastor's wife that told us very consistently: S*x is the glue that holds a marraige together.

I would want to ask wives: why is coming together as one flesh with the man that you love such a sacrifice? (there are a lot of questions that go along with this but the final line goes...and that body of yours doesn't belong to you anymore.)

I would ask the husbands: Have you protected your wife from exhaustion, from over-commitment, from having to burn the candle at both ends?

How shortsighted and weird to create a program that essentially places a legalistic constraint of sacrifice upon wives. It makes sex unspontaneous, unfree. It makes it dutiful and obligatory.

The same thing could be said about going to church to worship 3 times a week...what? You mean I have to schedule it?

I see sex as (yes) a duty and an obligation. So is worship, so is prayer, so is teaching our children the ways of the Lord. So is going to work every day. And doing laundry, dishes, etc.

For a man, providing for one's family is a duty and an obligation. Leading his family in a Christ-like way is a duty and an obligation.

For either party, having something be a duty and obligation does NOT rule out having it be a joy as well.

I would offer up a challenge/question: Why is this a "sacrifice" and what would it take to move it from the "to-do" list to the "wanna-do" list? And are you willing to do it?

That should be the point of the exercise. If it's a sacrifice to joyfully give pleasure to your partner, why? And how do you change that?

Ellen, I don't disagree with any you said. I stand by my point, however, in that this program is not a call to mutual sacrifice but to wifely sacrifice. They should just say that.

And I also stand by the point that if its intimacy they want to cultivate, they should have 30 Days of Conversations or 30 Days of Husbandly Encouragement or 30 Days of Couples Devotionals or some such thing.

Given that men in the church have dropped the ball over the last 50 years, I am skeptical about the wisdom of this programmed approach to intimacy.

well...it all seems legit to me and since it comes from a church then I think we must try to join with this "ministry" opportunity...I for one don't plan to question it, just encourage the good work. =)

Cheers.

...this program is not a call to mutual sacrifice but to wifely sacrifice.

The minute I heard about this pastor's "challenge." I was afraid this would be the reaction. What I hear above sounds like: "In marriage this would mean my wife having more sex than she has time/energy/desire to give, so this program is bad." Frankly, these reactions are more of an admission than an assessment. If it were an attempt at assessment, it's one that begins with self, not Scripture. In the atmosphere of sexual ascetism of the Corinthian church (think 1 Cor .7) it's easy to imagine the same reaction to Paul's mandate (yes, that's a mandate) for spouses not to deny each other sex. The truth of Scripture is that Paul castigated those that would deny accommodating their spouse's sexual desires. He could easily have said, "But unto the married I say, love is sacrificial and self-denying, so be holy and restrain yourselves until your spouse dishes out another ration." A proper reading of 1 Cor 7 more addresses the one who is withholding (whether it be lower libido, resentment, felt needs or whatever) and says, "sex is your right and obligation. In fact, even your bodies are owned by your spouse." (In a culture where "owning" someone was common, they knew the gravity of what Paul was requiring.) What I'm saying, Jared, is that by citing that a wife will have to have more sex than she might want, you're fighting an uphill battle against Scripture. You can rightly extol self-sacrifice, yes, but I see you dangerously close to using one Scripture to demolish another. Paul knew what he was saying when he was saying it; celebrating fulfillment, distaining denial, warning the denier (be it wife or not) that such denial would be a stumbling block.

Perhaps this pastor could have called it the "First Corinthians Seven Challenge" or something like that.

As for the "ewwwww" response, sorry, that's just childish. Right up there with "cooites." Seriously.

I’m late in the game but here it is anyway.

I loved having sex with my man but to mandate it means that you are taking the moment of loving each other away. I picture a couple looking at their schedules, we call it the war board, and freaking out because they can only have time between running the kids somewhere or late at night when they both find the bed. I would think that it wouldn’t be that great for either one of them.

Don’t men care about the quality?

I think the good ones do.

"ewwwww" with "cooites."

I don't think I'm being understood. And the reason I don't think I am is because I agree with your appraisal of the biblical mandates toward marital intimacy.

All that you just said, E., I agree with and myself taught in the relationships series for young adults we completed last year. Withholding as leading spouse into temptation, not neglecting, mutual submission, mutual sacrifice, etc.

What I object to is attaching a law (30 consecutive days) to something that we all know favors the will of one gender over another. I still say, "Why sex?" Why not conversation? Why not prayer times? Those things can still set the grounds for intimacy and sex and they do so in the spirit of the law.

I'm all for wives sacrificing and submitting.
I'm also all for men doing the same. If you want to talk about using one passage to demolish another, I think this program attempts that by not including 30 Straight Days of Husbandly Sacrifice.

And the "ew" is not about frank talk of sex. It's about the borderline immodesty in the congregational sharing of sex lives.

I picture a couple looking at their schedules, we call it the war board, and freaking out because they can only have time between running the kids somewhere or late at night when they both find the bed. I would think that it wouldn’t be that great for either one of them.

Personally, Milly, I don't think that life would be great for either one of them. If you have to schedule your sex life around soccer practice (or whatever) you're too busy.

And I'll put in the frame of worship again. "Having to put in time at church from 10:30 until noon just takes that moment of worship away. That's too much of a sacrifice." or "looking at my schedule, I have to take this kid to this thing and that kid to that thing and American Idol is on - Don't men care about equality?"

Imagine 30 days of putting your spouse in front of playing taxi. Imagine 30 days of putting your one-flesh-other in front of television.

Wow...that would be such a huge sacrifice. (not) There is such a thing as a life that is too busy - and if you're too busy to spend a few minutes each day connecting in a one-flesh manner with the one you've committed your life to - that sounds too busy.

Jared, would it make a difference if it was a basketball game (or other favorite sports event) that was set aside for intimacy?

In my marriage, it was the opposite - and I never saw marital intimacy as a sacrifice.

What do you think that men could do so that their wives no longer saw intimacy for too many days in a row as a sacrifice? Maybe that is the point - and a better conversation starter.

(can you imagine the dark beauty of the Song of Solomon saying..."but that's too many days in a row!")

I just read the guide for married couples from the church in question (admittedly for the first time).

I'm wondering how many people read the actual information before they started criticizing?

There are such questions as question: Back when you were dating you did just about anything you could
to spend time together - picnics, tennis, working out, etc. What favorite activity
of your spouse would you be willing to participate in? Now schedule to do it.

There is a Scripture reading for each day.

it's as much 30 days of intimate connectedness as it is 30 days of consummation.

Good.
Why are they calling it the 30 Day Sex Challenge?

Maybe they read the Song of Solomon? ;-)

Why are they calling it the 30 Day Sex Challenge?

I once heard James Dobson say, "Men tend to sexualize intimacy, women tend to intimize sexuality." I start with that because I believe it addresses one of the problem couples face when trying to implement many attempts at marriage building. If the church as a whole talked equally about sexual fulfillment as it has about meeting romantic needs, we'd have far less problems. Paul knew this, but Augustine and Jerome didn’t get it, and we’ve been paying the price since. You might even agree with that; you probably do. But here’s the thing: without the specific (and most importantly, equal) focus on sex, some or even many women will turn it into another “how to” for romance and get irritated that “he’s doing it to try to get sex.”

So yeah, I understand the church initiating a (voluntary!) program that gets away from the over-sentimentalized, Hallmark channel, family-safe programs for marital intimacy designed to keep the whiny "eeeewww" crowd feeling safe in their pews.

"The man said, 'This is now heart of my heart and my best friend; she shall be called 'sweety,' for she is so special to me.' For this reason a man will leave his father and mother and be united to his wife, and they will snuggle." That's EWWW. That's what we're teaching these days.

That's what we're teaching these days.

Who's we?
Not me. I don't identify with anything you just said. As such, I'm out. There's no use defending myself against things I agree with.

Ellen,

I'm all for spending time with my spouse. The reality is that many of us have too much on our plates. We are very careful to not over do it with our kids. I'd love to spend quality time with my man. I know that it is needed. But on nights like last night I had a headache, a hockey game, and dinner to attend right after work. I was up at 4:25 am for that day. I had to be up early and was in need of a shower plus it was after midnight. To stop and spend time with him would have been at best stressed for both of us. I in no way think that it would bother all woman to have sex with their husbands for thirty days some of us women enjoy it a lot but to make it an everyday thing would be a stress on both sides. A stay at home dad might feel that at the end of the night he deserves to sit back with his wife and watch Lost rather than having to have sex at that moment. I don’t think this slights women I think it slights both spouses if you are told to have sex every day for thirty days.

Thirty days of being attentive to each other is an awesome idea on the other hand.

Well...I guess I'd have to say that if you're that busy, don't participate.

I still have to wonder what that dark beauty of the Song of Solomon would say.

I don't necessarily have a problem with the program the church is doing. I just hate the gimmicky-ness of it all (and the graphics for the series). It's like 'look at how edgy we are.'

My first thought was, "What if we don't want to?"

Is this because my husband and I are both 49?

Really. There are certain things we are commanded to do. As I read it, the command is to love each other.

After nearly thirty years of marriage I happen to KNOW that neither one of us want to do much of anything 30 days in a row.

I am SO NOT a fan of 'challenges'.

Really.